The Knights As YouTube Comments, No. 1

if the sight of a jew doing culturally jewish things and/or practicing the religion makes a person go 🫵 POTENTIAL EVIL LYING CHILD KILLING ZIONIST, APPROACH WITH CAUTION🫵 they are already antisemitic. and it’s going to take a lot of research and self-reckoning and uhh talking to jews in good faith for them to come back from that mindset. and many won’t undergo that process because it’s uncomfortable and shame-producing. and i honestly can’t show grace to folks who have unknowingly fallen down that rabbit hole because the conflation of “jewish” with “evil and bad” has already gotten jews killed this year. and it’s gotten jews killed for thousands of years. and unless gentiles start unpacking that long-ingrained cultural assumption that Jew = Suspicious, Probably Evil, Destroy Now we’ll see more pogroms in the future.

and before you come into my mentions with “but israel,” please understand that gentiles have never needed proof to believe jews are evil and murder them. right now, antisemites are gleeful that they have a “reason” and too many of y’all are just following their lead because you refuse to engage with this information. because you’re not an antisemite, right? you just hate zionists, not jews. and you definitely know what zionism is and you definitely can surmise when zionist is being used as a dogwhistle. right! of course! there is no historical precedent that would lead me to not believe a single word you say.

so like. if you truly want to help fight antisemitism, you have to engage with these ideas even if the process is uncomfortable and shame-producing. you have to unlearn 2,000 years of lies about us and the deeply ingrained instinct to believe we are evil. idk why i’m making this post i just wish gentiles would be believe us when we say It’s Really That Fucking Dire.

Griflet also gets a flower crown, but his is ambiguous.

happy lancelot and his crown of roses day to all who celebrate :)

As an Arthuriana junkie who tried to secede from the United States of America in fourth grade, this made my month.

I was looking something up and I found this.

Normal so far, but wait... is that Molossia? As in parody micronation Molossia?

Yes. Yes it is.

what do you love most about kay which you would love to see in a story, like what would you find would make a good depiction of sir kay into a great depiction of kay

In order for Kay to be adequately sharp-tongued he needs to be sharp-minded.

Far too many Kays in retellings are just mean or crass in the basest sense. Phobic, cussing, and frankly come off as a dumb bully with no depth. Even when medlit Kay borders on a bully, he’s never stupid. He needs to be clever enough to have a quick clap back, to invent a witty nickname on the spot, call out Gawain or Gareth or Lancelot on their hypocrisy when no one else will.

Unintelligent Kay holds no interest for me and it’s a lazy way to write him that’s become all too common (not on tumblr, thankfully). It started with The Sword in The Stone (1963) movie and it’s gotten worse from there.

Other than that, I want to see Kay resembling his Mabinogion characterization with the powers and stuff. He does have Otherworld powers in the Lavinia Collins books, but then, that requires reading the Lavinia Collins books but I don’t recommend whatsoever. There are many historical fiction examples from Henry Treece or Edward Frankland, but they don’t have magic. I want the magic!

Additionally I want Kay who is both Arthur’s foster brother and his seneschal, simultaneously. This is more common in books, retellings are pretty good about that. Movies are slacking! Only a handful where he gets to be both!!

Lastly I want his close relationship with Bedwyr restored. Again, there are a decent amount of retellings I could point to as examples that do a great job with that. But I want Gawain too! And Lancelot! And Guinevere! And Ragnelle! Even Gareth!! The dream team. Kay can’t just be this outsider with no friends, that’s not true to medlit at all. They love him! Arthur loves him!!!!! SHOW IT TO ME!!!

This type of Kay is definitely here on tumblr. Seems bloggers understand the assignment! I see this Kay frequently in art and stories passed around here and that’s great. I’ve also attempted to include this sort of Kay in my books. But I want even more of him! He is the character ever!!!

Happy late ace day!

Arthuriana has so many major aspec characters, and it’s fabulous

Here are a few characters who I interpret as aspec:

Dinadan!!! He is an absolute aroace icon. In a source whose name has slipped my mind, Isolde comments on how he ought to be in a relationship and his reaction is something along the lines of, “Yeah, hard pass. How’s that working out for you, by the way?” (Read it with sarcasm).

Galahad, Bors, and the Grail Heroine all seem quite happy about the eternal chastity thing. None of them have any close calls with demon ladies, unlike poor Percival, the one allo person in the friend group. (Yes, Bors has a son, but a cursed ring was involved there, which is why as much as I do not stand Bors’ Morte misogyny, I will always pity him).

Kay is very rarely ascribed romantic relationships, and in one Welsh source, his father prophesies that Kay’s heart will be “eternally cold”, which could be interpreted as never enflamed by love.

Any others who come to mind?

I'm a big fan of Madoc ap Uther, although I haven't written much about him yet. Here are some of my thoughts on him, not all of which are characterization-related but hopefully will be helpful:

He's described as "protector of happiness" (in "Madawc Drut", Marged Haycock's translation), which I find really interesting, as well as "a citadel of prowess/through feat and jest". Protector of happiness could be referring to his humor entertaining people, to his martial prowess keeping them safe, or both. (The same goes for the title itself: "drut" could mean bravery or foolhardiness but could be related to "drúth", Old Irish for jester).

Either way, it sounds like a sort of a duty, like this is something he feels obligated to do, which is obvious if he's a warrior but says a lot about his personality if he feels obligated to make jokes and keep others happy. Maybe there are some citadel walls around his inner nature and emotions; that might be a stretch in terms of literary interpretation, but potentially interesting in terms of characterization.

He seems to be very well-liked and seen as a merry fellow, but he definitely has a serious side: "before {he} was slain / he pledged himself by his hand", which is rather cryptic and suggests a sense of duty as well as a dire circumstance.

He was the son of Uther but didn't become king, so he could be Arthur's older brother who was killed before Uther died or a younger brother who didn't succeed Uther because Arthur was the eldest son (which would suggest that Arthur was raised by his biological parents). He could also be a younger brother who was the heir but was killed before Uther died (if Arthur was raised by Ector/Cynyr), but he is Eliwlod's father, so he was old enough to have children at the time of his death, which makes the last option seem less likely.

Skene's translation of "Marwnad Madawg"/"Madawc Drut" is much longer and says that he was killed by "Erof", but Haycock claims that that's the result of multiple poetic fragments which were on the same page being mashed together and that that bit is actually part of a lost poem about King Erof, AKA Herod, being dragged down to Hell. I think her translation is generally considered more reliable (and seriously doubt that Madoc was killed by King Herod, though that would be interesting).

He might be referred to as "{t}ransgressing" and "a famous leader" in a poem along with other heroes like Bran, Arthur, and Alexander the Great, but Madawg/Madog/Madoc is not a rare name. There are at least two different Madawgs mentioned in the Black Book of Carmarthen (ap Maredudd and ap Gwyn) who definitely aren't him and one who might be him but might not. As it is, the only pretty-certain references to him are "Madawc Drut" and a brief mention in Arthur's dialogue with the eagle. This is just about all the information we have to go off of, so my fondness for him comes entirely from "Madawc Drut", which is, unsurprisingly, from The Book of Taliesin.

Do we have any Madoc ap Uther/Madawg ap Uther fans out there? I'm trying to combine him with the more "continental" legends bc I think it'd be interesting but I'm wondering if anyone's written him before or has some characterization thoughts?

Morvran Afagddu Appreciation Post

I am obsessed with Morvran Afagddu’s life story. With how he’s expected to amount to nothing to the point that his mother tries to make him talented with a potion and someone else gets it instead and he grows up to be a great bard anyway. With how no matter how great he is, what he says is doomed to be obscure forever. With how that’s contradicted by Uther Pendragon himself mentioning Afagddu while Uther is dying. With how that shatters all the timelines, since Morvran is a child at the start of Arthur’s reign and also survives Camlann. With how he survives Camlann because of his appearance, the reason why they thought he wouldn’t get anywhere in the first place. With the life he built and kept partly because of the things which people thought were wrong with him. With how he might not even be one person, might be two characters who blurred into one and in the process made a story which is one of Arthuriana’s most hopeful, a story formed from fragments and only existing on the boundaries of other people’s but existing nonetheless.

Morvran might be my favorite knight of the Round Table, and he’s not even technically a knight. A lot of Arthuriana is tragic, at least when you look at overarching narratives, and that pathos is extremely compelling, but it's also refreshing and joyful when a character can rise above it and endure against odds that seem impossible, and that's what Morvran's story is to me.

References: Ystoria Taliesin, "Angar Kyfundawt", "Marwnat Vthyr Pen", Culhwch ac Olwen, Marged Haycock's notes in Legendary Poems from the Book of Taliesin

I have been working on a project with something similar to that as the premise for a while now, though my Taliesin's not as genre-savvy and the timelines he goes between are all either medieval or of my own invention/amalgamation, not from modern retellings.

It would be cool if he bridged retellings as well, and that could make an excellent fic. What I'm writing is a bit different from that in flavor and I do hope to ultimately publish it.

Anyway, I see your vision and laud it.

Do you think there's potential if you can use Chief Bard Taliesin as The Fourth Wall/Meta Guy™ of Arthuriana?

As in, Taliesin - as a supernatural storyteller, arguably superior to the prophetic Merlin - being an almighty observer of ALL continuities of Arthuriana, able to know who is who, what happens in what version, and just being able to jump in and out of the different storylines whenever he wants.

One moment, Taliesin is hanging out in Caerleon-on-Usk, performing for Lucius Artorius Castus and then teleport on over to laugh at Monty Python!Arthur and co. getting owned by the killer rabbit.

In another scene, Taliesin talks about the different versions of the Grail Quest to Arthur and Peredur, giving comments about what he likes and doesn't like about each one, while expressing how he's annoyed with the French writers obsession with Lancelot and Tristan. Also, Taliesin gets to talk about all the different love interests of Lancelot and Gawain to French!Lancelot (who's in complete meltdown) and Welsh!Gwalchmai, who's like 😎

Taliesin predominantly hangs out with Merlin, his tutor Blaise and fellow aspiring bard, Sir Dinadan, inside Magic Treehouse!Morgan's Treehouse but every once in a while, Taliesin gets into an adventure and then brings along whatever character he needs, from Sir Segurant and Culhwch to BBC Merlin!Merlin and Fate!Artoria.

Lynette's family in Arthuriana

We all have heard of Lynette. We either have met her in Alfred, Lord Tennyson’s poem, “Gareth and Lynette” from the Idylls of the King, or in Le Morte d’Arthur by Sir Thomas Malory. From the mid-19th century to the present day, many works have included her either as a minor character or as the main character of her own story. As is usual, it became a curiosity of mine to find out more about her and about her family as well. In order to do so, I researched four different Arthuriana, three from the 12th century and the other one from the 15th century.

The first Arthuriana is the English one, titled “Le Morte d’Arthur” written by Sir Thomas Malory in the 15th century. In Book IV (Winchester manuscript), a damsel appears at the Pentecost feast, asking Arthur for his assistance. She withholds her identity and where she comes from. All she wants is one of Arthur’s best knights to fight for her sister who is being besieged by a tyrant.

Naturally, Arthur says no because she won’t give him more information. As we know, Beaumains (in reality, Prince Gareth of Orkney) volunteers. This pisses the damsel off because she thinks he’s a kitchen boy. During the journey, she and Beaumains clash constantly with each other. It takes them time to earn each other’s respect. It also leads for them to trust to each other. It is at Sir Persaunt of India’s city that their names to each other are revealed.

Sir Persaunt reveals her name as Lyonette (Linet in the Caxton manuscript), to which she admits it is so. Further down the text, Beaumains makes them swear not to tell anyone (which they swear not to do so) and reveals his own name.

In the end, Gareth wins against the Knight of the Red Lands, also known as Sir Ironside. He also falls in love with Lyonette’s sister, Dame Lyonesse. But she shoos him away by telling him to wait until a year later so that he gains experience and more renown. However, she changes her mind and tells her older brother, Sir Gringamore, to kidnap Gareth’s dwarf. The narrative reveals that Sir Gringamore is married. Moreover, he lives in the Isle of Avalon as it is revealed much later.

After a lot of shenanigans happen (one of them involving an undead knight), a year later Gareth marries Lyonesse. In addition, Lyonette and her niece Laurel (most probably Sir Gringamore's daughter) are married to Gaheris and Agravaine in an arranged marriage.

On the other hand, in the 12th century Arthuriana, “Érec & Énide”, written by Chretien de Troyes, Sir Gringamore, called Guigomar in the narrative, appears as a guest in the wedding of Érec and Énide. He is called the Lord of the Isle of Avalon, as well as Morgan le Fay’s “friend”. His younger brother Graislemier of Fine Posterne also appears as a guest, alongside twenty companions that came along with him.

It is of interest to mention that in another of Chrétien de Troyes’ poems, “Yvain Or The Knight Of The Lion”, Lunete mentions to her mistress, Laudine, that she got a message from her contact Demoiselle Sauvage informing her that Arthur will be coming around Laudine’s lands and she still doesn’t have anyone to defend her fountain. Similarly, in Malory, Lyonette is also called Damsel Savage as well. There is the probability that Malory took inspiration from this unnamed damsel from Chrétien de Troyes and ascribed the title to Lyonette. However, there’s not enough research that proves this possibility.

Lastly, in the First Continuation of Chrétien de Troyes’ “Perceval” written by an unknown author, Sir Gringamore makes a reappearance once more in the narrative. He’s called Guingemuer rather than Guigomar. In the story, Guerrehet (Gareth as he’s called in the narrative) avenges his half-fairy son King Brangemuer, whom he had with Queen Brangepart (a fairy). The king was named after both his parents and it is implied in the narrative that now that his mortal side is gone, he’ll still live through his fairy side of the family.

If these sources are conflated together, it can be thus concluded that:

Sir Gringamore is the Lord of the Isle of Avalon. He was at one time a lover of Morgan le Fay and he was also the lover of a fairy called Brangepart with whom he had a son called Brangemuer. He later got married and had daughter called Laurel. He’s the eldest of four siblings.

Sir Graislemier of Fine Posterne is the second brother of Sir Gringamore, and most probably lives in Avalon or in a territory adjacent to it.

Lady Lyonesse of Castle Perilous is the third sibling and youngest sister of Gringamore and the eldest sister of Lynette. She holds her own lands close to the Isle of Avalon. Moreover, she holds a magic ring that changes appearances. She married Sir Gareth of Orkney.

Lady Lynette is the youngest sister of four siblings. She's a healer, knows the magic arts, riser of the undead and wandering damsel. She’s otherwise known by Damsel Savage. She has different contacts, one of them being Lunete. She married Sir Gaheris of Orkney.

Lyonesse, Lynette and Laurel are close in age, since they married three of the Orkney brothers.

References

De Troyes, C. (2015). The complete story of the Grail: Chrétien de Troyes’ Perceval and Its Continuations (N. Bryant, Trans.). Boydell & Brewer Ltd.

De Troyes, C. (2018a). Érec & Énide (A. S. Kline, Trans.). Poetry in Translation. https://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/French/DeTroyesErecEnidehome.php

De Troyes, C. (2018b). Yvain Or The Knight Of The Lion (A. S. Kline, Trans.). Poetry in Translation. https://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/French/DeTroyesYvainhome.php

Malory, T. (2009). Sir Thomas Malory’s Morte Darthur: A New Modern English Translation Based on the Winchester Manuscript (D. Armstrong, Ed. & Trans.). Parlor Press LLC.

✨🧡🌙SEND THIS TO OTHER BLOGGERS YOU THINK ARE WONDERFUL. KEEP THE GAME GOING ✨🧡

Thank you so much!