Ah... This is a painful topic. I felt it was a problem with a screenplay on a fundamental level. Not everything to do with RDJ’s brilliance (though that too. He is RDJ). It’s just that... All It was “Tony’s family“, “Tony’s youth”, “Tony’s grief“, “Tony’s girlfriend left him“, “Tony’s PTSD“ “Tony’s heart problems”. Yes they made sure we understood Tony’s motivation. I loved his arc in this. But what about Steve? He deserved to be on the same level of character study. But they couldn’t even give him half decent monologue about his worldview. In his own last film! (Yeah, and why would we need his family and childhood in this? It’s not like they had an influence on him as a person. We’ll better see Howard for the tenth time). And now next time we see Steve it will be in Avengers and there won’t be any time for him as a character. Sorry but I really don’t understand how Tony’s fans can be unhappy with his treatment in mcu when he basically had 6 films where he is the no.1 character and there is a “Homecoming“ on the way.
That was the problem with Civil War. It wasn't a Cap film. The emotional arc came from Tony and overshadowed Steve's arc. Which would have been fine for an Iron Man movie. But not a Cap movie.
I do think that Steve’s character had an emotional arc and would argue that he actually went through the most change by the end, giving up the Captain America mantle, but I agree that Tony’s role and RDJ’s wonderful acting allowed him to be far more obviously emotional, which naturally drew the viewer to what he was going through. I know a lot of people felt the same way as you, Anon. Definitely a lot of Cap fans feel that he didn’t quite get his due, and I would agree with that.
As I’ve said, I loved the movie and am glad we had it, but I would like a Cap movie where Captain America is the focus and we see him and his team fight actual Captain America bad guys. Of course, I know there is a whole overreaching MCU that CACW had to work into, but yes, I’d love another Cap movie. Well, and IM4. Basically, give it all to me! I know these movies do have to end someday, but I still feel like there are more stories to tell. Maybe Tony could actually defeat his own villain in IM4? Just throwing that crazy thought out there.
This is so true. I liked cacw but this is what really ruins it for me
but the entire first half of CA: the first avenger was showing steve's childhood and backstory.
(assuming this is a reply to this post)
By the time we see Steve in CATFA, he’s already an adult trying to enlist in the war. CATFA showed us a nice backstory of who Steve was (who he had grown to be at that point) before he had the serum, and who he turned into after it.
Captain America: Civil War did not show us:
- who Steve’s mother was, what she was like, what she looked like, if she influenced Steve at all, what memories he has of her, how old she was when she died, how she died, how exactly her death affected Steve
- who Steve’s father was, if he was in Steve’s life at all, if he was symbolic in any way, what his name was, how he died, if his death affected Steve at all
- what steve looked like as a little kid (omf baby steve can you imaGINE)
- why Steve believes the things he believes, how he grew to fight prejudice, if prejudice and assumptions were important things in his childhood- if they had any affect on his family or on him- the evolution of his character born both out of himself and out of his environment and the things that must have happened to him
Captain America: Civil War did show us:
- who Tony’s mother was, what she was like, what she looked like, that she influenced Tony, what memories he had of her, how old she was when she died, how she died, and how exactly her death affected Tony
- who Tony’s father was, that he was in Tony’s life, that he was symbolic, what his name was, how he died, and how exactly his death affected Tony
- what Tony looked like as a young adult
- and why he believe the things he believes, how he grew to fear attachment and resent himself, the things he did and saw in his youth that impacted him in his adult life, the evolution of his character born both out of himself and out of his environment and the things that did happen to him
Yeah. McCain understands
truth
This is so cute. And Tony with his tech. Would be cool to see all of them
Oh my god can I just like?? Say how ABSOLUTELY FUCKING AMAZING it is that in Avengers Assemble STEVE has a PAINTING of NATASHA SMILING.
Like a GENUINE smile not a smirk which is what’s usually on her face. It’s like, he got to see her smile so genuine and bright and he. Just. Had. To. Paint it.
BEAUTIFUL. 😍
#petition for kevin feige to give us an entire movie with loki pretending to be steve rogers
Nancy : I just lost my work partner
Nancy : So Cap got me a new one
'Danger magnet' TK Strand:
Nancy: I don't feel good about this.
Come on, this is the best
thaddeus ross: *puts team cap in super secret ocean jail*
steve:
I agree. That’s exactly right. You can’t dismiss some character’s pain and trauma to ennoble your favorite. IMO its disgusting. But come on, Tony’s fans do it all the time! If it angers you all so much then stop doing it to other characters. Many times I’ve seen these completely dismissive posts about Steve, Natasha, Wanda, Bruce, etc and for some reason nobody reminded authors about human decency. I think it should be applied to every character not only Tony
I don't get why you baby Stark so much. So his father neglected him? He was too busy to tuck him in or hug him? Yeah that's shitty as fuck but Howard loved him in his own way. Clint Barton, abused by his own parents and then abused in the circus before left for dead. Steve Rogers, bullied and beaten his entire life pre serum, sick constantly and only family his best friend who he LOST. Natasha, I don't think I need to elaborate on her past.. Wanda&Pietro, fuck of their story isn't awful.
Wow.
So by your line of reasoning, only the Avenger who had the worst childhood is worthy of love and/or respect. I guess that means Bucky isn’t worthy, since his childhood was the best out of all of everyone. But no - in your eyes, Tony is the only one whose abuse can be excused.
Well let me tell you something, anon. I am fucking appalled by the fact that you are literally excusing child abuse by saying that “his father loved him in his own way,“. As if that makes it okay. There is no excuse for child abuse. Ever. Period. It doesn’t matter if it’s emotional neglect or physical abuse or whatever, there. is. no. excuse.
In addition, abuse, especially child abuse, is not a competition and I can’t even put into words how upset it makes me that you’re implying that Tony is not worthy of being “babied” just because you think his abuse wasn’t as bad as the rest of the team. As though there is some sort of ruler by which we measure abuse, and Tony isn’t making the cut.
Finally, I’m gonna let you in on a secret. Fandom is a place where everyone gets to like whoever they want to like. I will “baby” Tony as much as I damn well want to, and you can fuck right off.
Choose a side with these new Civil War Hot Toys!
That Scarlet Witch one tho…damn, I want it.
(Via ComingSoon)
One of the things I love about Steve Rogers is that he goes against the archetype of good/optimistic characters only being – and deriving their goodness/optimism from being – innocent and naïve.
Steve isn’t naïve. Steve grew up in hardship. In the comics, he was abused and watched his mother be beaten by his father. In the movies, he had no father, but was violently bullied and dirt poor. Steve grew up in the school of hard knocks, in the middle of the Depression; any naïveté about how cruel the world could be got beaten out of him as a child.
And then, Steve signed up to go to war. He fought on the front lines of WWII, and witnessed untold violence. Some comics and cartoons show him helping to free concentration camps. And he fought – Steve never had the luxury, as Cap, of having a “no killing” rule like Superman. He’s never relished taking lives, but he’s done it when necessary. Steve is no unsullied innocent.
From all this hardship, all this violence, Steve could easily be a character who has a grim, cynical outlook on the world. He’s seen and experienced the absolute worst of humanity; he’s borne witness to genocide, after all, and horrors of war. And usually, the characters who have endured brutality are the ones who are the bitter anti-heroes, or dark and angsty heroes – the Batmans and Daredevils, the Wolverines and Punishers. Meanwhile the hopeful, optimistic heroes are often the ones who have had warm and loving homes, and who haven’t been broken yet by the world.
But Steve, despite everything, stays hopeful. Steve believes in the best of humanity, in spite of having seen it at its worst. Steve believes in the importance of Good, because he has looked deep into the heart of Evil.
Steve has suffered all his life, but he refuses to let the world break him.
That refusal, that strength of outlook and principle, and that subversion of archetype with a rejection of the increasingly popular grimdark hero narrative, are all reasons I love Captain America, and find Steve Rogers a truly interesting and inspiring hero.
Because it’s true
That weird moment, when the “election 2018” and “circus” billboards are next to each other